Covid-19 News

  • 25X Growth in Ivermectin Sales & NY Times Declares the Drug ‘Doesn’t Work’


    25X Growth in Ivermectin Sales & NY Times Declares the Drug ‘Doesn’t Work’
    Ivermectin sales have skyrocketed worldwide as many populations across many nations are using the FDA-approved anti-parasite medication as a proactive
    trialsitenews.com


    Ivermectin sales have skyrocketed worldwide as many populations across many nations are using the FDA-approved anti-parasite medication as a proactive early treatment against SARS-CoV-2 infection, the virus behind COVID-19. According to a recent New York Times (NY Times) piece, prescriptions across America have increased nearly 25-fold from the beginning of the pandemic until mid-August 2021. Ivermectin is currently being studied in two major Phase 3 trials in the United States; one, called the COVID-OUT study, is led by the University of Minnesota in partnership with UnitedHealthcare. Another National Institutes of Health (NIH)-sponsored study is being conducted by Duke University, called ACTIV-6. Another prominent study at University of Oxford (PRINCIPLE) included the drug. Over 63 studies around the world involving over 26,000 patients indicate some positive impact. At the same time, dozens of nations have used ivermectin during the pandemic, some quite successfully, such as India’s Uttar Pradesh, a heavily populated state with over 220 million people that proactively used the drug as part of a home-based home healthcare regimen caring for those with COVID-19. Ivermectin is still used pervasively across parts of India, Brazil, Bangladesh, and even Slovakia, where health regulators provisionally authorized it. In America, Dr. Jacques Rajter led the successful ICON study in Broward County, Florida. The results of which were published in the peer-reviewed journal Chest. While sales have skyrocketed, so has the criticism, warnings not to use the animal version of the drug, and most recently a New York Times declaration that there is, “No evidence it works.” TrialSite concurs with the recent Times piece that any self-medication and/or use of veterinary products represents a real problem. Moreover, we agree that some of the research indicates neutral to no benefit. Yet numerous studies indicate positive data points as does considerable real-world evidence in various parts of the globe. Additionally, with nearly three dozen ongoing studies, why would the New York Times journalist, Emma Goldberg, issue a declarative statement proclaiming there is “No evidence that the drug works” when she acknowledges there are over 30 ongoing studies with more data to review? Such positioning and placement of the language indicate an agenda.


    Huge Demand Leads to Shortages

    The mainstream media doesn’t differentiate between the skyrocketing demand for ivermectin determined by the source. Reading much of the press leads one to believe that the demand is driven by the veterinary product, fueled by misinformed people who self-medicate. However, most of the demand is from physicians prescribing the product off-label. At least as of this writing, this is perfectly legal, although frowned upon by many physicians. Then, of course, there is veterinary use and abuse if the consumption involves self-medicating humans.


    The recent Times piece reports on the huge demand for the drug across the United States, indicating that prescriptions have risen to over 88,000 per week in mid-August. Goldberg writes that this is markedly up from the average of 3,600 per week at the pandemic baseline, according to researchers from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention CDC). That’s just about a 25-fold increase since the baseline of the pandemic.


    In many communities, Ms. Goldberg reports pharmacists declaring shortages of the drug. For example, in places such as Kuna, Idaho, pharmacist Travis Walthall cannot get enough product in stock.


    A Problem: Self Treatment & Animal Product

    Goldberg follows several mainstream media reports on the growing calls to poison control centers due to rising ivermectin use. TrialSite has tried to secure such data before, which has been difficult. According to the New York Times, the CDC cited data from the American Association of Poison Control Centers that declares a five-fold increase in calls about the drug. But we don’t doubt that people are abusing the drug based on what they read on social media.


    Growing reports account for dangerous self-medication, often embracing the animal version of the product. While TrialSite’s Ivermectin Fact Check indicates the drug can lawfully be prescribed off-label (assuming full disclosure to the patient), individuals buying and consuming the animal variety are the real topic of the NY Times piece.


    Goldberg reports that, according to the Mississippi health department, about 70% of the calls associated with the state poison control center involve “…people who ingested ivermectin from livestock supply stores.”


    One toxicologist down in Texas, Dr. Shawn Varney, reports the number of calls involving ivermectin at the South Texas Poison Center have tripled—the vast majority associated with the veterinary product.


    TrialSite concurs with the NY Times reporter that if these reports are accurate, they reflect a growing problem with self-medication and a deep chasm between many people and their health care systems.


    Journalism That Doesn’t Include the Other View

    Ms. Goldberg shared in her piece that ivermectin “has not been shown to be effective in treating COVID,” yet people are “clamoring to get the drug.” Citing the FDA’s “You are not a horse” marketing effort cautioning against the use of the veterinary drug, Goldberg uses select information for her declaration that the drug doesn’t work at all for COVID.


    While throughout the piece, Goldberg explicitly and implicitly communicates that the drug doesn’t work—that there is absolutely no evidence that it could be a possible tool to use in the fight against COVID-19—she doesn’t mention that over 63 completed studies evidence at least some positive data points. However, the journalist doesn’t look at all of the studies or even discuss a contrarian viewpoint with medical professionals who prescribe the drug off-label. Instead, she follows a careful script meant to offer up the negative answer.


    For example, she cites a few sources, including a recent Cochrane review of 14 ivermectin studies involving over 1,600 participants declaring there was no apparent benefit. This particular meta-analysis doesn’t include studies that other meta-analyses use to come up with a positive finding.


    Goldberg points to the recent McMaster University-led Together Trial showing the drug didn’t produce any better than the placebo. Although PI Dr. Edward Mills was declarative that the drug doesn’t work, many knowledgeable experts are critical of the study design, as TrialSite recently shared. TrialSite reported that several researchers expressed concern about the Together Study protocol, indicating challenges with dosage, the timing of dosage, and other factors such as the fact that many were already taking ivermectin in the region of Brazil where much of the study commenced.


    The NY Times writer also emphasized a questionable study led by Eduardo Lopez Medina, which indicated no statistical significance based on the results. Dozens of researchers and physicians have protested that study, as Dr. Michael Goodkin indicates in a recent article published by TrialSite.


    Many of these critics authored a complaint letter to the publisher, sharing several concerns, including the fact that this obscure Colombia trial site received numerous pharmaceutical payments during the study, including ones from Merck, the company that happens to be developing a competitive pharmaceutical therapeutic called molnupiravir.


    Not mentioned by Goldberg was a faulty Egyptian study that certainly looks to be problematic. Although this study showed a positive ivermectin outcome, the results are in question due to what appears to be unacceptable fudging of data, among other things.


    Moreover, she precludes material information that other major institutions have embraced the drug for Phase 3 studies—these are the studies that lead to approvals. A study drug cannot make it to this late stage without showing that there is at least some evidence to justify the investment in the clinical trials process. Thus she omits any discussion of pivotal Phase 3 studies investigating ivermectin, including the COVID-OUT and the NIH ACTIV-6 study.


    Why not Present Other Data?

    Although Goldberg acknowledges there are “another 31 studies…still underway to test the drug,” she doesn’t bother to provide any countervailing points of view, and this is a real problem observed with what we call the “special interest” journalism of today. There appears to be ever more biased (usually industry-centric) content that frankly is turning off readers. Goldberg just reinforces that problem with this piece.


    She doesn’t seek out any other points of view on the matter. For example, the authors of at least two (2) meta-analysis indicating the drug shows some effect, including Bryant et al. and Kory et al.


    TrialSite’s library includes meta-analyses from Italy and India, indicating some positive data points.


    But the NY Times writer doesn’t bother to look into any opposing views domestically and demonstrates no curiosity into massive use cases in places like India. For example, millions of people used the drug as part of the Uttar Pradesh state public health regimen to beat back the Delta variant-driven surge in the spring and early summer.


    While media industry “fact-checkers” have attempted to shoot down the Indian information, TrialSite’s investigations reveal irrefutable activity, evidenced by dozens of interviews and articles in mainstream media in India. Recently, an Indian doctor’s interview highlights some of the positive outcomes involved.


    What About the Methodology Behind the Evidence?

    Many of the critics of the ivermectin-based studies declare that there just aren’t enough studies yet and that the many dozens of studies revealing positive results unfortunately derived from suspect-designed studies from the Third World.


    Out of these 63 studies comes a significant amount of supportive clinical trials evidence associated with COVID-19, including randomized (31) and observational (32) studies, over 26,000 patients, and a near majority of all studies finding at least some important benefit with treatment.


    TrialSite suggests a comparison with the average amount of evidence relied upon to formulate the treatment guidelines of the Infectious Disease Society of America (IDSA):


    In a 2010 review of 65 of its most recent guidelines, the IDSA found that 50% of guideline recommendations were made without any trials evidence in support and were termed “expert opinion only.”

    Another 31% of guideline recommendations were based solely on observational studies, while only 16% of all recommendations were based on at least one randomized controlled trial.

    In other words, the number of legitimate clinical trials for ivermectin have been superior to those for the IDSA’s treatment guidelines if one assumes appropriate underlying study design (which we recognize many don’t).

    Interestingly, ivermectin was approved for the treatment of scabies by the WHO based only on ten randomized controlled trials, including 852 patients. This is despite the fact that the trials found ivermectin was actually inferior to the permethrin cream it was being tested against. It essentially won approval based largely on its low cost and use of administration.


    The WHO arrived at such a bold recommendation without the pressure of a pandemic, given it was based on such a seemingly small evidence base.


    We also emphasize that the NIH Guidelines for COVID-19 have multiple strength levels of recommendation available to them, from weak or “consider” to making use near mandatory. TrialSite suggests that the public should demand from the IDSA and NIH credible explanations for the anomaly of not arriving at even a weak recommendation for ivermectin, one of the safest, affordable, and widely available medicines known. The safety record of the drug is well known and doesn’t need to be defended here.


    Finally, no credible physician or journalist recommends that people self-prescribe with veterinary forms of ivermectin. Experts such as the Front Line COVID-19 Critical Care Alliance have been working tirelessly for months to persuade the public health agencies to provide more specific guidance to physicians on using ivermectin to treat patients with COVID-19.


    The FLCCC suggests that increasing calls to poison control centers directly result from their failure to provide such guidance and education to U.S citizens.


    The Real Concern

    TrialSite suggests a real concern of the research and medical establishment is that the use of ivermectin is perceived to be:


    Getting in the way of the vaccination program.

    Not monetizable at the levels possible with this pandemic.

    Exhibit implicit if not explicit bias of academia and research elites to the research and care initiatives in low-and middle-income countries (LMICs).

    The mainstream media, including the NY Times, position that vaccine-hesitant people are using ivermectin as an alternative to the vaccine. But early treatments, whether they be ivermectin or some pharmaceutical, are necessary to combat COVID-19. A vaccine-centric strategy isn’t sufficient for society to overcome this virus.


    The NIH is fully aware of this fact—that is, that antivirals will be key moving forward. With over $3 billion in new antiviral pharmaceutical clinical research, the apex research body knows all too well that a vaccine-centric strategy to overcome COVID-19 isn’t sufficient.


    Rather, the war against COVID-19 is won via a combination of tools from safe and effective vaccines to therapeutics (both branded pharmaceuticals and low-cost generics) paired with sound, rational and data-driven, risk-based public health measures ongoing. Antivirals, or drugs that behave like antivirals, serve an important role, and if ivermectin eventually fits into that category, it should be accepted by health authorities.


    Because drug development is a risky, competitive business requiring enormous capital outlay and a high probability of failure, the race is on during this pandemic for rich monetization. Gilead generated $3 billion during the first nine months of the pandemic thanks to remdesivir pandemic-driven sales. Moderna has transformed from a money loser to market power, while Pfizer may generate tens of billions per year from its vaccine.


    Of course, there are exceptions, as Merck showcased with its ivermectin-based Mectizan program, a notable effort to eradicate river blindness in tropical areas. But generally, as University of California Hastings College of the Law professor Robin Feldman writes in “Drugs, Money and Secret Handshakes,” that prescription drug prices continue to grow is no accident.


    And because much of the ivermectin research and care evidence has occurred in low-to-middle-income countries (LMICs), much of the medical establishment in places like America and England aren’t that interested in results, regardless of the outcome. They do have a point. The studies aren’t nearly as well-funded and well-designed as pharmaceutical industry studies. Groups within the NIH and academia have low confidence levels in some small studies in places from Bangladesh to Brazil. They will refer to those studies that don’t yield results, when convenient but the reality is that mostly poorer countries have used ivermectin during the pandemic. Of course, that’s changing now based on the sales number reported by the NY Times.


    Where Does the Truth Lie?

    TrialSite suggests Ms. Goldberg’s employer directs the one-sided view, not the reporter herself. TrialSite concurs with Ms. Goldberg and the NY Times that self-medication with any prescription drug, or improper use of a veterinary product, represents a real societal problem.


    As an independent media and social network platform, we strive to provide a more objective point of view. Read TrialSite’s “Ivermectin Fact Check—An Independent TrialSite Breakdown” for our assessment of ivermectin at this point.


    We declare therein that ivermectin is not a cure for COVID-19 nor a silver bullet but instead could represent one of several tools a physician may use to combat the virus. That’s up to the licensed medical professional and their consenting patient. And, of course, more data is always needed for greater understanding.


    Mindful that the situation is complex, dynamic, and unfolding, we stand ready to adjust and update our position as data is available. While we are disappointed yet again with another one-sided mainstream media write-up concerning ivermectin, Ms. Goldberg at least doesn’t sink to the low levels of Michael Hiltzik, the Los Angeles Times hack for hire—read his “hit piece” here. Ms. Goldberg does at least try to contain herself, sparing the readers the features of the all-too-obvious hit piece.


    Call to Action: Regardless of one’s view on ivermectin, in the United States, one can only legally access the drug via an off-label prescription from a licensed and competent medical professional, and of course, the patient must consent. No one should self-medicate with the veterinary version of the drug. This is a dangerous and legally questionable activity.

  • No! Absolutely not. If the oximeter and fever tell me I am seriously ill, the last thing I want to do is "try something, anything." That is suicidal. What I want is expert treatment from experienced nurses and doctors. I do not want some drug that I know for a fact probably does not work, and if it does work, it is only marginal. You might as well try voodoo.

    Good of you to have total trust in what the health care establishment tells you. Wish I were that way, life would be so simple if so, but am stubborn I guess.

  • Having SARS-CoV-2 once confers much greater (13x higher) immunity than a vaccine


    The new analysis relies on the database of Maccabi Healthcare Services, which enrolls about 2.5 million Israelis. The 13-fold increased risk of infection in the same analysis was based on 238 infections in the vaccinated populationof 16,000 people, versus 19 reinfections among a similar number of people who once had SARS-CoV-2.


    It’s a textbook example of how natural immunity is really better than vaccination,” says Charlotte Thålin, a physician and immunology researcher at Danderyd Hospital and the Karolinska Institute who studies the immune responses to SARS-CoV-2. “To my knowledge, it’s the first time [this] has really been shown in the context of COVID-19.


    Not big surprise here. Big Pharma is not going to fund studies that don’t support booster shots. It’s just a business… But how natural immunity can get 13-times better than efficiency of already 95% efficient Pfizer vaccine goes over my head...;-)


    The mechanism of superiority of naturally gained immunity is quite apparent: the immune cells are learning to recognize coronavirus by recognising much wide spectrum of characteristics, than just single spike protein, as its common for Covid-19 vaccines. Even more importantly, such a wide holistic experience makes for immune cells way more difficult to confuse healthy tissue with virus target and to induce autoimmune disease.

  • Vaccination vs natural immunity


    There is an unhealthy tone here that I don't understand.


    EVERYONE agrees that for delta:

    • natural immunity offers typically (but not always) better protection than vaccination
    • natural immunity + vaccination is better than either natural immunity of vaccination
    • both natural immunity and vaccination have protection that decreases over time.


    None of that is surprising.


    Now: this is the switch-and-bait question. Why, if natural immunity protects you better than vaccination, does anyone bother to get vaccinated?


    Everyone knows the answer. Natural immunity sounds like a good thing. It is. But the only way to get it is to suffer COVID.


    Luckily vaccination first followed by COVID - which is what will happen to a lot of people - is less deadly than COVID without vaccination.

  • The 95% efficiency has nothing to do with infection, just prevention from hospitalization with severe or deadly disease progression…

    95% was in good old alpha times...But also without vaccination only 2% of the PCR+ will go to a hospital. With delta we have 10x more passive infection so 0.2% of the infected go to a hospital.


    This is why the real "vaccine" efficiency is around 1%(0.1% with real infections) max e.g. 90% of 2% or 50% as of today in UK. Out of this 2% 1/4 .. 1/3 ends up in ICU. So real vaccine protection from death is far below 1% (0.1% real case number with delta).

    This is totally different for e.g. Hepatitis, Tetanus, pox where the real protection is > 1000X.


    What people do not understand is the fact, that there are two different views.

    1) Personal risk is strongly reduced with a vaccine if you are high risk

    2) Personal risk is not reduced with a vaccine if you are low risk

    Overall = population wide risk/protection is very low with the current gen therapy.


    Today's facts: Gen therapy ("Vaccines") give zero protection from a symptomatic (PCR+ cold symptoms) CoV-19 infection with delta. Vaccination makes only sense for high risk person to protect the medical system from overload.


    Here in Switzerland the young obese - party tigers - "migrants second generation" have been the most recent problem as this small group did produce 40% of the new hospital load.

  • Luckily vaccination first followed by COVID - which is what will happen to a lot of people - is less deadly

    This is only true for the first few months following vaccination. Pfizer is worst with about 15% left over protection after 6 months. See Israel data. Why do you believe they today apply boosters to all vaccinated???


    Natural immunity is sterile but gen therapy ("vaccine") immunity is not.

    Natural immunity induces a broad immune memory - gen therapy does not.

    Natural immunity lasts > 10 years see SARS1.


    So if you got the vaccine do hurry to get an infection!

  • I am certain you know that is what I meant

    No I don't . I can't read your mind. It may be clear there, but I just read sloppy writing..

    when you were editing Mizuno's stuff ,,,you were less sloppy.

    There was one death in NZ after vaccinating about 3 million...with Pfizer...not a billion

    If there had been a billion, proportionally there would have been over 300 deaths

  • The new analysis relies on the database of Maccabi Healthcare Services, which enrolls about 2.5 million Israelis. The 13-fold increased risk of infection in the same analysis was based on 238 infections in the vaccinated populationof 16,000 people, versus 19 reinfections among a similar number of people who once had SARS-CoV-2.


    “It’s a textbook example of how natural immunity is really better than vaccination,” says Charlotte Thålin, a physician and immunology researcher at Danderyd Hospital and the Karolinska Institute who studies the immune responses to SARS-CoV-2. “To my knowledge, it’s the first time [this] has really been shown in the context of COVID-19.”


    Not big surprise here. Big Pharma is not going to fund studies that don’t support booster shots. It’s just a business… But how natural immunity can get 13-times better than efficiency of already 95% efficient Pfizer vaccine goes over my head...;-)


    Big Pharma companies - like any company in a capitalist system - want to make money for their shareholders (mostly your pension). There is an interesting question whether companies should be ethical and do things that the directors think might benefit society but harm their shareholders. Views differ. I think it is a false dichotomy. Big companies do have valid capitalist reasons for acting ethically: their long-term success is tied up with the economy; their work-force will be better motivated if they feel they are helping society; good PR helps any company. When young (and more radical than I am now) I used to see big companies as the obvious enemy. Now I see them as a thing. They can offer real good, sometimes, with good direction and corporate culture. Others can offer real harm. Most just do what they can to survive and are pretty morally neutral. Pharma companies have more of an incentive to do good than others, because they need to be seen as honest and working to help patients. They have more temptation than others because when you put $100M into a drug it sort of matters whether you get that borderline regulatory permission or not.


    Regulators are there to ensure that companies do not overstep, to make a fair playing field, and in the cause of medical drugs and vaccines to ensure that people get medical interventions that do help and not harm. There are many many examples of drugs sold over years that overall have done great harm. In the US the current example is prescription opioid addiction (oxycontin etc). My father was put on a (low) dose of opioids for chronic back pain. It did not do any long-term good, and after a year or so, reading about the dangers of addiction, he stopped it. His dose was low enough that he had no dependency. In a different environment, a different person, with less support and more stress, could easily have upped dose repeatedly and become addicted.


    Doctors do not always help this. When faced with patients who have chronic pain they want to do something, and a pill that promises to reduce pain is a clear solution. Even if long-term it ends up not reducing the pain and getting anyone who takes it addicted. Over-presciption of opioids:

    Tracing the US opioid crisis to its roots
    Understanding how the opioid epidemic arose in the United States could help to predict how it might spread to other countries.
    www.nature.com

    has harmed US health a lot.


    In 2015, something happened in the United States that hadn’t occurred there in the past 100 years: life expectancy entered a period of sustained decline. According to the World Bank Group, the country’s average life expectancy fell from 78.8 years in 2014 to 78.7 years in 2015, and then to 78.5 years in 2016 and 2017.

    In most high-income countries, life expectancy has been increasing, gradually but steadily, for decades. The last time that life expectancy in the United States showed a similar decline was in 1915–18, as a result of military deaths in the First World War and the 1918 influenza pandemic.


    This time, the culprit has been a surge of drug overdoses and suicides, both linked to the use of opioid drugs. The death rate from drug overdoses more than tripled between 1999 and 2017, and that from opioid overdoses increased almost sixfold during the same period.

    More people in the United States died from overdoses involving opioids in 2017 than from HIV- or AIDS-related illnesses at the peak of the AIDS epidemic. “Most people living have never seen anything this bad,” says Keith Humphreys, a psychiatrist at Stanford University in California and a former White House drug-policy adviser.



    So what should regulators do? They allow opioids - and for short-term use they are great. No-one should say they must be banned. Even, in some cases, for long-term use when people will die soon they are great. The balance here lies with doctors who, if good doctors, will read and believe the (latest) science, prescribe for their patients benefit and make sure patients do not get addicted. And also look out for street addiction, people getting prescriptions to sell them, etc.


    Talk about not understood long-term harms. This, from a well-tolerated and very widely prescribed drug, is as high as it gets. And Pharma pushing this (to increase sales) doctors using it because it works, are both culpable.


    The only way to reduce cases of drug misuse is to have strong and vigilant regulators, and doctors who are pro-science and understand that medical science does not provide fixed answers, but that prescribing based on popular fashion is dangerous. Pretty well everything is a trade-off between benefit and safety, and that can change.


    So what about ivermectin? It is a well-tolerated very safe drug. The people on it for COVID have about 5% significant side effects - gastrointestinal stuff mostly.


    I see it as being like most alternative medicine. There is often a small possibility of medical effect. There are millions of happy patients who think it is helping them regardless of whether it does.


    The difference is that with most conditions - having something that you think makes you better improves your perception of symptoms and therefore helps.


    With COVID, having something that you think makes you safe leads for many to less adherance to other safety measures (vaccination or social distancing) and so more illness.


    It is no good saying - it is just an extra (possible) help. No-one will do less in other areas. That will be true for me, and many on this thread. But not for everyone where the idea that you have a cocktail of drugs effective enough to lunt the worst of COVID will mean not getting vaccinated 9if you believe the antivax lies - probably most here don't) and otehr risky stuff.


    Things change. If you are double vaccinated (fairly recently) then arguably for most people the safest thing to do is to catch COVID. That will boost your immunity (we think) and the chances of harm to you doing, while real, are much lower. Since COVID will not go away that is maybe a clever strategy if you reckon you will catch it anyway at some point. I have to say I am not brave enough to go to COVID parties and follow this. Also there is the initiial dose question. Too much COVID will make outcomes worse.


    I can see, given all this, why until you have 100% vaccinated population, governments who above all don't want TV pictures or people being turned away from hospitals because of lack of beds, want to do everything they can, whatever it is, to up vaccination rates. Behavioural scientists tell us however that is not to force vaccination on people, or to require vaccine passports widely.


    it is not a big pharma conspiracy that makes regulators and authorities dislike ivermectin. It is:

    • Balance of evidence is against it (might change, but the data from the big high quality trials looks negative so far)
    • People are desperate for a cure-all drug. Ivermectin is being sold on social media as that. That message is dangerous.
    • ivermectin is still given prominence in all the government-funded find a drug testing. More so than personally I think it deserves, though it deserves to e looked at.



    Why be slightly negative (apart from the poor trial evidence?

    Remdesivir at least had good in vitro evidence of effect at levels achievable safely, and was known effective against related viruses.

    Other anti-viral candidates have at least good in-vitro evidence

    ivermectin has in-vitro anti-viral non-evidence (amount needed much larger than can be tolerated). It has that one golden hamster study that is very positive but not double-blind and in any case not in humans. It is not a strong starting point


    Which does not mean ivermectin might not work - since all these things are uncertain - just that it looks poor. The four planks of evidence that convince may here are:

    Strong advocacy groups

    Some 3rd world country's caving in to these and using it as standard treatment, or even prophylatic

    Inter-country comparisons that appear favourable (evidence that does not hold water)

    A lot of favourable results from low-quality trials (does not hold water when results get progressively worse the more you up the filter on trial quality, and when non-mortality outcomes do not look so positive even on favourable - include the studies with probable and known bias - meta-analyses)


    Personally, I am used to people (including scientists) being stupid. You always get this, and so advocacy of miracle drugs on poor evidence is par for the course. I know FLCC etc are fanatics - not clear-eyed scientific investigators, because the evidence they advance is very poor, and they say it is good. One example, Bryant et al (FLCC + BIRD) refused to withdraw Elgazzar's fraudulent study from their meta-analysis when everyone else did. the proper thing to do is what Hill did, which is withdraw the meta-analysis until it can be re-written without Elgazzar.


    Anyway - all the sound and fury does not matter. Ivermectin will have its fate determined, as should be, in the best possible way by randomised blinded high quality trials. Just a few more months to be sure.


    Until then what I despise, and find harmful, is the conspiracy theory tone of comment and the idea that the medical establishment is out to prevent people having a helpful drug. It is just not true. i am not in hoc to big pharma - and were I a regulator i would do as has been done - allow doctors to prescribe ivermetin off label at their own risk, or as part of investigatory studies, point out that so far there is no evidence of its effectiveness.

  • (mostly your pension).

    Really??? < 10% is for population pension...


    One example, Bryant et al (FLCC + BIRD) refused to withdraw Elgazzar's fraudulent study from their meta-analysis

    Why was it fraudulant?? The study was correct the data too there was a minor issue with an unimportant branch. (They had 5 classes/branches of patients.) So please stop citing FUD from mafia journals.

    I know FLCC etc are fanatics

    You in fact are a fanatic vaccine terrorist. If a doctor sees thousand of people dying because fascists money greedy people do block a treatment/cure of CoV-19, then they are upset. Upset is not fanatic.


    We all know for 100% that ivermectin works as a prophylaxis and treatment. > 1'000'000'000 people on this planet successfully use it for CoV-19. This is real data not you fringe fantasy.

  • mRNA vaccines are less sterile than getting COVID: Patently false.

    Getting COVID leaves not just COVID iuself but little fragments of COVID RNA littered all over your body at high concentrations. No comparison with the tiny amount (millions of times less) of non-replicable, because coding for spike proteins only, vaccine mRNA.


    Natural immunity induces broad immune response, vaccine immunity does not: Partly true

    By design the 1st generation mRNA vaccines (and the other vaccines) all target spike proteins. The problem is that natural immunity is very variable. A lot of people with weaker immune systems do not get a strong response from it - and those are the ones who will die from COVID.


    Natural immunity lasts > 10 years see SARS1 : Mostly false

    Natural immunity can last 50 years (see measles) or less than 1 year (see Flu). And varies because different elements of memory last different lengths of time. Which elements protect depends on many things, including how effective a person's immune system is. It is no good having long-lasting T cell memory of COVID if you are an older person with a poorly functioning T cell immune system. the SARS1 evidence is encouraging but we do not know how it extends to COVID, nor do we know how widely it applies in practice. It would be fair to say "there is some evidence that parts of natural immune response will last > 10 years".


    So if you got the vaccine do hurry to get an infection! Debatable

    You might want to wait until we have much better treatments, to reduce risk. The various antibody treatments look promising if delivered fast and in the right way. So do CD24 Exosomes (though little evidence so far, in phase 2 trials). Vaccine reduces risks of bad things a lot but does not eliminate them. However it is true that catching COVID 9 or 12 months after a vaccination your protection will be less than what it is 1 month after vaccination. Also (more important) catching COVID after vaccination may help with immune response to a new COVID variant - we know these will propagate eventually. I doubt many people will choose this to happen, equally it will happen to many.

  • Why was it fraudulant??

    • The data was cut-and-pasted.
    • The text was cut-and-pasted (plagiarised).
    • The results were so extraordinarily good (better than any other new drug trial for any viral disease) that any normal scientists would check them


    Is Ivermectin for Covid-19 Based on Fraudulent Research?
    A tale of what could be, if true, the most consequential medical fraud ever committed
    gidmk.medium.com

  • The data was cut-and-pasted.

    AS said they mixed 17 patients from one branch into an other what is bad style and not wrong at all if you look at the meaning of the branches. So if early treatment did fail a patient becomes a member of the severely ill group. But what then is wrong is claiming 500 people in the study albeit some were double use...

    As said just bad style or unscientific but no wrong results.


    So bad for the vaccine terrorist. They could fail the study but not the data...But what interest us is not the study just the data.

    El Gazzar was the first that did show that high dose (2x6x or 3x4x) Ivermectin makes the difference in ICU.

    So basically his message - over a year ago - did already save countless lives.

  • Good of you to have total trust in what the health care establishment tells you. Wish I were that way, life would be so simple if so, but am stubborn I guess.

    The problem is - who else do you trust? A niche of the internet (here) dominated by a news site set up by somone with a bee in his bonnet that delivers its own very eccentric views? Doctors running an ivermectin pressure group that most medics think is misguided and unhelpful? Most people in the UK go to their own GP who then points out why ivermectin/hydroxychloroquine/etc are unproven drugs with as yet no evidence.


    I posted above the negatives of saying (on current non-evidence) that ivermectin works. You might think why not, since medically it will not do any obvious harm. But in other ways it can and has already done harm to some people.



    Clearly the posters on this forum are generally smarter than average and well educated, and yet even on this forum there are diametrically opposed interpretations of the same data.

    So how average Joe is supposed to make sense of it all?

    I think the average joe goes to his GP whom he trusts to interpret the advice.


    All it seems we see are stories about those unvaccinated "idiots" getting severely sick, and dying, but fact is the vaccinated are getting Delta (breakthroughs) AND are getting sick also. Some severely, and yes, some dying. I want something in my back pocket if that happens to me.


    What may I ask are you going to do if, god forbid, you get symptomatic? You are already vaccinated. Don't you want to at least try something, anything, instead of waiting until your lips turn blue and then check into the ER?


    The vaccines are great, and have saved many lives, reduced severity of breakthrough infections, but I want an anti-viral to have in the medicine chest as a Plan B. If I think it works, it is safe, and there are some studies backing it, I WANT it!


    You, the FDA, and the WHO should just mind your own business if you disagree. Surely you have better battles to fight than dissuading people from using a safe drug in a pandemic?

    If everyone left it to local doctors, who can look at the guidance and reach their own views, all would be good. But we have sustained and powerful ivermectin pressure groups working to influence people, which then creates pressure on doctors.


    See my post above why recommending a safe but ineffective drug in an epidemic is not a safe thing to do. And the establishment allows ivermectin under medical investigation conditions.

  • AS said they mixed 17 patients from one branch into an other what is bad style and not wrong at all if you look at the meaning of the branches. So if early treatment did fail a patient becomes a member of the severely ill group. But what then is wrong is claiming 500 people in the study albeit some were double use...

    As said just bad style or unscientific but no wrong results.

    That report was wrong in so many ways, and had very surprising results, to trust it would be an act of folly or fanaticism. Without very careful protocols and checking scientific data gets all messed up here, as has happened here. I'm not interested in whether this was deliberate fraud r incompetence, using the results now this is known is gross scientific malpractice.

  • Long covid rare in children, vaccine warriors take notice!


    Long-lasting Covid-19 symptoms rare in children


    Long-lasting Covid symptoms rare in children - BBC News
    Children who become ill with coronavirus mostly recover in less than a week, research suggests.
    www.bbc.com


    King's College London scientists say that while a small group may experience prolonged illness, they were "reassured" that number was low.


    Headaches and tiredness were the most common symptoms seen.


    A Royal College of Paediatrics and Child Health expert said the data reflected what doctors saw in clinics.

    Compared to adults, children are far less at risk of coronavirus.


    Many who are infected do not develop symptoms and those that do, tend to have a mild illness.


    This peer-reviewed study, published in the Lancet Child and Adolescent Health journal, wanted to understand how Covid affected children and how it compared to other respiratory diseases.


    It used data provided by parents or carers to the UK Zoe Covid Study app.


    The study looked at 1,734 children, aged between five and 17, who were reported to have developed symptoms and tested positive for Covid between September 2020 and February 2021.


    The researchers say it's very difficult to know how many children were infected during this time period as the four UK nations record data differently, but they estimate more than 400,000 children and young people tested positive.


    Fewer than one in 20 (4%) were found to have experienced symptoms for four weeks or more, with one in 50 (2%) having symptoms for more than eight weeks.


    The most common symptoms reported were headaches and tiredness. Others included a sore throat and loss of smell.


    On average, older children were typically ill for slightly longer than primary school children, with those aged between 12 and 17 taking a week to recover while for younger children the illness lasted five days.


    It's the scientists hope that these findings will reassure families, while also validating those who have experienced prolonged illness.


    'Listen to families'

    The team also looked at an equal number of children who had symptoms but tested negative for Covid.


    Only a few children - 15 out of 1,734 - had symptoms for at least 28 days, fewer than one in 100.


    Emma Duncan, professor of clinical endocrinology at King's College London who worked on the research, said the "takeaway message" was: "Can children have prolonged illness after Covid-19? Yes they can, but it's not common and most of these children get better with time.


    "Children can also have prolonged symptoms from other illnesses as well. We need to be looking after all children who have protracted illnesses, irrespective of whether that illness is Covid-19 or anything else."


    Dr Michael Absoud, a consultant in paediatric neurodisability at Evelina London Children's Hospital and a senior author of the study, says it's important to listen to families who say their children have symptoms.


    "If you are concerned about your child, the first thing you need to do is go to your GP and describe your particular symptoms," he explains.


    "They can provide information or refer you to a paediatrician. It's important to remember there may be something else going on.


    "If they think it is related to Covid, there are NHS clinics dedicated to providing advice on how to approach this. Hopefully they will be properly funded to support this small proportion of children."


    Dr Liz Whittaker, infectious disease lead at the Royal College of Paediatrics and Child Health who was not involved in the research, said: "This study is reassuring for the majority of children and young people who develop Sars-CoV-2 infection, and reflects what paediatricians are seeing in clinical practice."

  • Fewer than one in 20 (4%) were found to have experienced symptoms for four weeks or more, with one in 50 (2%) having symptoms for more than eight weeks.


    The most common symptoms reported were headaches and tiredness. Others included a sore throat and loss of smell.


    On average, older children were typically ill for slightly longer than primary school children, with those aged between 12 and 17 taking a week to recover while for younger children the illness lasted five days.


    It's the scientists hope that these findings will reassure families, while also validating those who have experienced prolonged illness.

    That is in line with what we had preciously had reported. Worth pointing out though that while this is fairly good news, if we say 50% of that 2% go on to have long-term problems, that is still 730,000 children in the US.


    That needs to be weighted in the balance with pericarditis etc when deciding whether vaccination is good or bad for children.


    THH

  • 88,000 prescriptions written, no reports of overdose or deaths nor even a headache, and best of all no reports of prescribed ivermectin patients being hospitalized. Proof is in the patients recovering!!!

  • another blow to the vaccine warriors!Harvard Epidemiologist Says the Case for COVID Vaccine Passports Was Just Demolished

    New research found that natural immunity offers exponentially more protection than COVID-19 vaccines.


    Harvard Epidemiologist Says the Case for COVID Vaccine Passports Was Just Demolished
    A new study on Israel's COVID outbreak found that vaccinated individuals had 27 times higher risk of symptomatic COVID infection than those with natural…
    fee.org



    Anewly published medical study found that infection from COVID-19 confers considerably longer-lasting and stronger protection against the Delta variant of the virus than vaccines.


    “The natural immune protection that develops after a SARS-CoV-2 infection offers considerably more of a shield against the Delta variant of the pandemic coronavirus than two doses of the Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine, according to a large Israeli study that some scientists wish came with a ‘Don’t try this at home’ label,” the Scientific American reported Thursday. “The newly released data show people who once had a SARS-CoV-2 infection were much less likely than vaccinated people to get Delta, develop symptoms from it, or become hospitalized with serious COVID-19.”


    Put another way, vaccinated individuals were 27 times more likely to get a symptomatic COVID infection than those with natural immunity from COVID.



    A Death Blow to Vaccine Passports?

    The findings come as many governments around the world are demanding citizens acquire “vaccine passports” to travel. New York City, France, and the Canadian provinces of Quebec and British Columbia are among those who have recently embraced vaccine passports.


    Meanwhile, Australia has floated the idea of making higher vaccination rates a condition of lifting its lockdown in jurisdictions, while President Joe Biden is considering making interstate travel unlawful for people who have not been vaccinated for COVID-19.


    Vaccine passports are morally dubious for many reasons, not the least of which is that freedom of movement is a basic human right. However, vaccine passports become even more senseless in light of the new findings out of Israel and revelations from the CDC, some say.


    Harvard Medical School professor Martin Kulldorff said research showing that natural immunity offers exponentially more protection than vaccines means vaccine passports are both unscientific and discriminatory, since they disproportionately affect working class individuals.


    “Prior COVID disease (many working class) provides better immunity than vaccines (many professionals), so vaccine mandates are not only scientific nonsense, they are also discriminatory and unethical,” Kulldorff, a biostatistician and epidemiologist, observed on Twitter.



    Nor is the study out of Israel a one-off. Media reports show that no fewer than 15 academic studies have found that natural immunity offers immense protection from COVID-19.



    Moreover, CDC research shows that vaccinated individuals still get infected with COVID-19 and carry just as much of the virus in their throat and nasal passage as unvaccinated individuals


    “High viral loads suggest an increased risk of transmission and raised concern that, unlike with other variants, vaccinated people infected with Delta can transmit the virus,” CDC Rochelle Director Walensky noted following a Cape Cod outbreak that included mostly vaccinated individuals.


    These data suggest that vaccinated individuals are still spreading the virus much like unvaccinated individuals.


    The Bottom Line

    Vaccine passports would be immoral and a massive government overreach even in the absence of these findings. There is simply no historical parallel for governments attempting to restrict the movements of healthy people over a respiratory virus in this manner.


    Yet the justification for vaccine passports becomes not just wrong but absurd in light of these new revelations.


    People who have had COVID already have significantly more protection from the virus than people who’ve been vaccinated. Meanwhile, people who’ve not had COVID and choose to not get vaccinated may or may not be making an unwise decision. But if they are, they are principally putting only themselves at risk

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