Display MoreSome points about COVID interventions.
In the UK, where numbers of deaths have historically been high, the vaccination program has had an enormous affect, saving lives. There is no doubt that those double vaccinated are much much less likely to go to hospital, to die, to spread COVID to others.
The statistics here are not some complex scientific study - but whole population monitoring. They cannot be denied. Navid W, Mark u etc please comment if you like.
So it is not surprising that those concerned about COVID are so obsessed with vaccines. They work. Much better than anything else.
The UK is not controlled by Bill Gates, nor any sinister QAnon-style conspiracy, nor an elite of lying medics. It has been in the forefront of all the technologies used to combat COVID: mRNA and viral vector vaccines, testing, discovering effective drugs for COVID treatment.
This work has saved countless lives. Dexamethozone alone must by now have saved some 20% of world COVID deaths, since it is effective, cheap, widely available.
The UK is now pushing to test, productionise, and roll out effective anti-virals. We know these exist. We also know that HCQ does not obviously help, that there is as yet no evidence for Ivermectin helping (and I doubt it will).
The one thing that is currently increasing the death toll, and that is under all of our control, is vaccine hesitancy.,
Propagate anti-vax propaganda or subtler anti-vax memes and you increase vaccine hesitancy in other people who you have maybe never met, who are vulnerable, and who die. Everyone has a responsibility to look at the big picture facts and not get carried away on conspiracy theories or interesting but very small scientiifc effects.
Do this over time and the lower than could be vaccine numbers mean the COVID R number gets a bit higher, and that increases deaths exponentially (until an infection saturates).
We have now seen again and again how these effects work on a large scale with the results being dead humans in hospitals -not just numbers in a preprint.
We have also seen again and again how careful and independent the vaccine registration authorities are throughout the world, even though it results in appalling PR. They are all independent, take different views as to risk, update those views when data that comes in and allows them to do so. But all of the vaccines are very very safe. Even so, when the individual (tiny) risk looks worse than the individual benefit authorities recommend the vaccine is not taken.
The sub-thread on here that is propagating nonsensical anti-vax propaganda is harmful, and writ large in society (say on facebook) such things are a real cause of human death and suffering. Those swayed are not mostly sophisticated thinkers, and a general feeling that the establishment is out to do bad things is shared by many and will predispose to believing unfounded scare stories. I bet (may be wrong) if you look at those here advocating vaccine hesitancy you will find that thye, for one reason or another, are at low risk of bad effects from COVID. Whereas those affected, older, ethnic minority populations, in more cramped intergenerational housing, are at much higher risk.
The idea that vaccines could specifically influence human thoughts via interaction with magnetic proteins is so stupendously silly I guess those advocating it have tin hats on permanently and also would not see a critical appraisal of a hypotheis if it bit them in the arm: thay would in that case probably think it was a micro-drone delivered vaccine as part of a plan by Bill gates for world domination.
How sad, and tragic.
THH
THH,
It is indeed sad and tragic.
I would say most here (there are exceptions) do not "rail against" vaccines and thus it seems you miss the entire point....
You say the vaccines have saved millions, most likely true.... however, if there had not been push back against HCQ and Ivermectin, many millions MORE would have been saved. It is becoming increasingly clear that HCQ and certainly Ivermectin works. All readily available WHILE the vaccines where being developed with no certainty those vaccines would work!
Yet, you seem to not acknowledge this nor even the possibility that this push back and now revealed Fauci coverup was wrong, in error or even possible!! You concentrate on the vaccine when the vaccine is not even really the issue for most of us here. It was the seemingly, intentional hold back of available medicine that could have saved MORE millions WHILE the vaccines were being developed.
Can you at least acknowledge this possibility? If we do not learn for our past mistakes, we will not prevent them in the future! This is the root of what most here have against posts such as yours.
Secondly, you postulate that the vaccines are valuable at saving lives, this is most certainly true. They have been proven to have an impact on Covid19. What MY personal (and many here) issue is, that we do not know what LONG TERM damage these vaccines will have! More and more issues are coming out as time progresses. These vaccines HAVE NOT HAD LONG term testing. But you seem to not acknowledge the possibility that an mRNA vaccine, never widely used on humans with ZERO long term testing is a cause for concern, when early testing was deadly to animals and human testing was halted! Can you acknowledge this?
So we have two points that either you are intentionally ignoring the core issue or simply are misunderstanding what most concerns here....
1) Needless millions died due to the push back on HCQ and Ivermecting WHILE the vaccines were being developed. Most likely because when shown that these medicines worked well, they would have stopped the vaccine rollout, requiring the standard long term testing because a viable treatment was available. "Vaccine warriors" simply will not acknowledge this. If this is not the case, what is your evidence against it. We now have plenty of Ivermectin evidence and even HCQ is being vindicated.... even in Fauci emails to some extent.
It is also being proved, that the whole Covid issue was political and money minded. The Fauci emails are only icing on the cake. Seemingly more likely manmade and holdilng this information back prevented or slowed treatment. This was criminal!!!
2) Can you prove that mRNA vaccines will have NO major side effects and be deemed safe in the long run? If so, please provide the evidence of long term testing. This is the second issue you do not acknowledge that many here are grappling with. Not that the vaccines have some efficacy, but they may not be safe in the long term and this was all pushed through when Ivermectin was available. Long term testing needs to be done, but not by injecting millions without prior testing. I personally know of 5 people that may have died due to these vaccines. (Yes, I know I cannot prove it, but can you prove the vaccines did NOT?)
So the issue you (and another here) seem to miss is that most here are NOT against vaccines. We are against the way the push for these vaccines cost millions of lives by the willful and active push back of HCQ and Ivermectin, the ignoring of Vitamin D, Zinc and other substances that could have helped greatly. Most here are not against masks, but are aggravated that masks were pushed to no end, but no encouragement of Zinc, Vitamin D etc. You might say that "there are no RCTs that prove HCQ works". Well you would only be listening to those who did not WANT it to work. There are others who say it did. I do not think there is even a question about Ivermectin if one is only willing to look. But vaccine warriors cannot look at this evidence, it would damage their stance.
So that is the issue. You labeled your post "Some points about Covid interventions". Much of what you said is correct and I do not have any issue with. What I do have issues with, is the unwillingness to acknowledge the gross misconduct of the mass media, medical field (including Fauci) and handling of this pandemic. That millions of lives could have been saved if Ivermectin was genuinely investigated early on when it was first proposed.
AND that those who trumpet the vaccines so loudly, seem blind to the very plausible fact that these vaccines could be extremely damaging in the long term. This is not proven nor is it unproven. Past testing showed that mRNA vaccines had severe issues and we do not have successful long term trials to show these are without issue. Yet some will not acknowledge that.
I could label my post "Why points of some Covid interventions caused millions of needless deaths".
As with most subjects, they become tribal or "religion". It does not matter what the facts say. Rothwell once stated that Cuomo was a leader that should be followed and used as an example to lead the Covid fight. "That a true leader" should be like....... now we really know don't we.... yet not a word of retraction there.
Same will be for Fauci as well.